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Friday, March 13, 2020

Response to Preston's 15th Video against Hope Resurrected - Election


I don't know why you would want to bother watching this lame video but for the sake of context here you go. It is a trash video from Don K Preston but absolutely amazing just for how lie-packed it is.
Before I go any further with my response I just want you all to know Don Preston literally disgusts me with every fiber of my being and now I am even more energized to expose him for the truly dispicable liar he really is. I had to restart this video about 5x because of the absolute absurdity. 

1st off, election is NOT my only argument in this book. If one has read the book all the way through (and Preston clearly has not or is willfully playing ignorant on this because he can't beat the arguments I present) you will know I do not just go on and on about election (though I do bring it up obviously in the book). So to sum this video up he wastes about 3 minutes of my time and yours by making excuses as to why he can't win the argument and gives nothing but ad hominems and other fallacies laced through this video as well. Thank you for wasting my time with that irrelevant horse maneur Don. And you act so baffled as to why I am unkind to you when you lie and misrepresent me? Seriously? LOL And spare me your virtue signalling hogwash about how holy and godly you are. A godly man would not lie and misrepresent people like you always do. 

I do not claim election to be a "time word" (whatever the heck that is supposed to be). Lies there about me. What I have said is that it is a word that is used in a temporal sense since ekelektos means to choose, to select, to vote according to every Lexicon in existance. We do not vote we do not keep selecting we do not keep choosing. Once you have chose you have chosen, once you have made a selection you have selected, once you have cast your vote you have VOTED. It ends and this is so obvious to anyone without an agenda to try to keep selling book sales like Preston. He claims I've never given biblical evidence for anything. Romans 11 and John 6 last I checked ARE biblical texts so this is another LIE. As is usual for Preston. John 6 has a LAST DAY for a reason. Romans 11 talks about the full number (pleroma is used numerically - Preston consistantly lies about this to try and fool you folks. It's used the same way in Romans 11 as Mark 8 uses it about a limited number of fish. Use logic. You can have a basket filled to the brim with fish but it's still a limited number of fish that can fit in that basket) being filled. 1 Cor 15 has a real resurrection that involves biological bodies which Preston denies because he's got an agenda to sell you folks. Simple as that. 

He's been disproven on this countless times over and over again. If you want to read a good refutation against Max King and Don Preston's (since he copies it almost word for word) arguments about 1 Cor 15 go read my Refutation of Max King. It has it all in there and I lay it out there. The Old Covenant ended at the Cross. Hebrews 8 shows us this. Don lies about me when he says that I have claimed the New Covenant ends. I have NEVER claimed any such thing and he is a bold-faced liar for continuing to claim this falsity about me. I have claimed that the election ends. Election ending and salvation ending for those who are not the elect does not equate to the end of the eternal New Covenant. Salvation is to come in fullness for Jew and Gentile (Israel) in Christ on the Last Day (John 6) when the full number of the Gentiles comes in and all Israel is saved (Romans 11:25-27). The promise is for Jacob. Not the loipoi. Only the eklektos. As for the growing in knowledge part, Don gave you all a half lie there (he tends to do that a lot. Just wait til he starts doing that to y'all too when you disagree with him on something)... The New Creation does not have to be static and I would argue it isn't. It is dynamic this promised New Creation. Furthermore, let's use Preston's logic here. Since AD 70 happened as he claims, then everyone should have perfected knowledge and know everything apparently. Sound about right? Funny cause if everyone's honest here I can safely say no one would be stupid enough to say they know everything except a complete mental basketcase. 

His rant about "until" makes no sense and is just a rambling bout of nonsense and I couldn't make heads or tails of any of that. I've also never claimed that God will not reign over heaven and earth. Another LIE from Preston AGAIN. You can't help yourself can you Don? 

Yes I do accept that death in all its forms physical and spiritual will end. I believe what Romans 8:21 says when it says "that the creation itself will be set free from its bondage to decay and obtain the freedom of the glory of the children of God". I also believe Paul when He says in 1 Cor 15:26 when he says "The LAST enemy to be abolished and destroyed is DEATH". Echatos echthros katargeitai ho thanatos! These are about the end of DEATH. ALL DEATH. Preston is talking through one's hat here... in other words (pardon the French but) he is bs-ing all of you here. As for how death is defeated today? That is easy. Paul as all NT writers do before the 2nd Coming teach the already not yet principle that Don always denies because he has an agenda to sell you folks. 

I feel sorry for anyone who actually buys into this liar's words.

My advice: take his words and think critically. 
Read some ACTUAL scholars and don't just take Don's word for anything as he lies and misrepresents people like it's breathing air for him. Comes way too naturally for him. 

That will be my response to this. If you guys really want to talk without all the lies feel free to join our groups Full Preterism - A Thing of the Past, World of Preterism, Clarion on Facebook. 

If you just want to talk to me, get in contact on Facebook with me at Lance Conley and PM me. I'll answer as long as it doesn't go to spam by accident or something. 

Absolutely garbage video from Don. I hope he is proud of himself cause everytime he lies and misrepresents people like this he does nothing but continually cement his status as a discredited pseudo-scholar.

7 comments:

  1. I will respond to Conley's hate filled tirade by sections / paragraphs to make it easier to read and follow.

    //This is an amazing video just for how lie-packed it is. Before I go any further with my response I just want you all to know Don Preston literally disgusts me with every fiber of my being and now I am even more energized to expose him for the truly dispicable liar he really is. I had to restart this video about 5x because of the absolute absurdity.

    1st off, election is NOT my only argument in this book. If one has read the book all the way through (and Preston clearly has not or is willfully playing ignorant on this because he can't beat the arguments I present) you will know I do not just go on and on about election (though I do bring it up obviously in the book).//

    Response: It is truly sad to see someone so young consumed with hatred and jealousy, as anyone who follows Conley's obsession with me can easily detect. Just sad.

    I have never-- EVER-- NOT ONCE, said that election is the only argument that you make in your book. I have said that it is your KEY argument that underlies all of the book. Do you deny that? I mean, in untold number of FB exchanges, when you have utterly failed to answer other arguments you invariably resorted to your appeal to the election argument.

    Thus, Mr. Conley, as usual, begins his tirade by making a false accusation.

    ReplyDelete
  2. Well, honestly, most of this is unworthy of comment, since it is empty and false verbiage, but here is what Conley says in his next two paragraphs:

    //So to sum this video up he wastes about 3 minutes of my time and yours by making excuses as to why he can't win the argument and gives nothing but ad hominems and other fallacies laced through this video as well. Thank you for wasting my time with that irrelevant horse maneur Don. And you act so baffled as to why I am unkind to you when you lie and misrepresent me? Seriously? LOL And spare me your virtue signalling hogwash about how holy and godly you are. A godly man would not lie and misrepresent people like you always do.

    I do not claim election to be a "time word" (whatever the heck that is supposed to be). Lies there about me. What I have said is that it is a word that is used in a temporal sense since ekelektos means to choose, to select, to vote according to every Lexicon in existance. We do not vote we do not keep selecting we do not keep choosing. Once you have chose you have chosen, once you have made a selection you have selected, once you have cast your vote you have VOTED. It ends and this is so obvious to anyone without an agenda to try to keep selling book sales like Preston. //

    Response: Did Conley give a single example of where I told a lie? No, because he can't. Does he give a single example of where I misrepresent his claims in the book? No, because he can't-- see my first response.

    Now, watch this: He says that he does not claim "election" is a time word but then turns around and says it is used in a temporal sense! LOL! Well, anyway you want to look at it, if "election" is used in a temporal sense, then it is being USED AS A TIME WORD!

    Mr. Conley tries to illustrate by saying we don't keep on voting when the election is over. The problem of course is, as I have proven repeatedly, that Biblically, the doctrine of election refers to the righteous remnant of Old Covenant Israel! it is not about the church.
    Furthermore, as I pointed out in response to William Vincent above, copied and pasted here:
    //"The elect" is not defined by number but by identity, by who they are. When scripture affirms that the Gospel and the church, established among men, as "unending" and "without end" then for you and Conley to affirm that the Gospel and the church will cease to function then you are in overt denial of what the Bible says. It means that you have totally missed the identity of "the election."//
    This also means that Mr. Conley has totally missed the point of "the election."

    ReplyDelete
  3. Here are his next two paragraphs:

    //He claims I've never given biblical evidence for anything. Romans 11 and John 6 last I checked ARE biblical texts so this is another LIE. As is usual for Preston. John 6 has a LAST DAY for a reason. Romans 11 talks about the full number (pleroma is used numerically - Preston consistantly lies about this to try and fool you folks. It's used the same way in Romans 11 as Mark 8 uses it about a limited number of fish. Use logic. You can have a basket filled to the brim with fish but it's still a limited number of fish that can fit in that basket) being filled.


    1 Cor 15 has a real resurrection that involves biological bodies which Preston denies because he's got an agenda to sell you folks. Simple as that. He's been disproven on this countless times over and over again. If you want to read a good refutation against Max King and Don Preston's (since he copies it almost word for word) arguments about 1 Cor 15 go read my Refutation of Max King. It has it all in there and I lay it out there. //

    Response: Well, notice-- again-- that Conley makes assertions with absolutely no proof given! He alludes to John 6 and Romans 11, but does he offer us any exegesis? Not a syllable!

    Pleroma means "fullness" what kind of fullness is not found in the word. The context of Romans 11 proves that the fullness in view is the full equality of Gentiles with Israel, in the one body of Christ, which was the focus of Paul's personal ministry. Remember, Paul said it was his personal, distinctive mission to bring about the completion of the mystery-- that Jew/Gentile equality-- Colossians 1:26-27. That is the fullness of the Gentiles-not the full number. In coming weeks I will be dealing with Romans 11:25-27 and I will give in-depth, exegetical proof that whatever Conley- or anyone else-- thinks, it was fulfilled in AD 70. We will see if Conley will deal with a single thing I say-- undoubtedly won't! But stay tuned for that.

    Now, it is out right amusing when Conley says "use logic" because he has no grasp of the fundamentals of logic. Let me illustrate.

    On FB, Conley attacked me the other day-- as he does every day-he claimed that because the words "AD 70" or Jerusalem, or "destruction of Jerusalem" etc., etc. were not present in a text under discussion, that this proves that I am wrong. Do you see what he is arguing? Conley is arguing that the absence of any given, specific word means that the doctrine found in that (those) words is not in those texts. I call this the Missing Word Hermeneutic and it is one of the most illogical, flawed, and specious- not to mention desperate-- hermeneutics one can imagine. Let's try Mr. Conley's own "Missing Word Hermeneutic" shall we?

    Let's see here: I want to challenge Mr. Conley to produce one single Bible text that uses the word "Trinity." Just one text where that word is found! Oh, wait! He can't, and he knows he can't! Therefore, according to Mr. Conley's own espoused "Missing Word Hermeneutic" there is no such thing as the Trinity! See how that "logic" works?

    And then, notice above how Mr. Conley claims that //1 Cor 15 has a real resurrection that involves biological bodies.//

    Wait! Homework time, folks! I challenge Conley or anyone, to go to 1 Corinthians 15 and find the term "biological bodies." Or, find the term "physical bodies." Hey, Mr. Conley, since 1 Corinthians 15 does not contain either term, or anything closely resembling it, then using your own "Missing Word Hermeneutic" that proves your doctrine of the resurrection of biological bodies is false! See how real logic works?

    ReplyDelete
  4. Do you notice how many times Conley accuses me of just selling books, and yet, over and over he urges you to get his book and read it? LOL! Anyway:

    //The Old Covenant ended at the Cross. Hebrews 8 shows us this.

    Don lies about me when he says that I have claimed the New Covenant ends. I have NEVER claimed any such thing and he is a bold-faced liar for continuing to claim this falsity about me.

    I have claimed that the election ends. Election ending and salvation ending for those who are not the elect does not equate to the end of the eternal New Covenant. Salvation is to come in fullness for Jew and Gentile (Israel) in Christ on the Last Day (John 6) when the full number of the Gentiles comes in and all Israel is saved (Romans 11:25-27). The promise is for Jacob. Not the loipoi. Only the eklektos.//

    Funny how Conley continues to make claims without offering one keystroke of proof. What is his proof that the Law passed at the Cross? He did not give any-- as usual. The fact is that Hebrews 8:13-- written long after the cross, said the Law had grown old and was "nigh unto passing." Well, folks, nigh (near) does not mean has already passed!

    And get this: Jesus said not one jot or tittle of the law or prophets would pass until it was ALL-- not some, not a little, not even MOST-- but until it was ALL fulfilled. Well, the Jewish feast days were a fundamental part of "the law." The last three feast days foreshadowed the Judgment, the parousia and the resurrection. So, Mr. Conley, tell us:
    If the law of Moses-- which included those eschatological feast days-- passed at the cross--how is it that those last three feast days remain unfulfilled? Can you explain that for us? Of course not, and you won't try.

    Then he simply repeats his mantra on the election. But you see, if election ends, and if salvation ends, then the Gospel "goes out of business" and the church ceases to function, which I have proven-- with scripture-- not mere hateful verbiage-- has no end.

    Notice that Conley makes the assumption-- unproven-- that "the last day" is the so-called, imaginary, "end of time." No, the resurrection was to be "when the power of the holy people is completely shattered" (Daniel 12:7)-- which was to be at the end of the 1290 days. Hey, Mr. Conley, was the 1290th day-- when the power of the holy people was shattered-- "the last day"-- which Daniel called "the appointed time of the end? Was it the last day?

    ReplyDelete
  5. Then we have this:

    //His rant about "until" makes no sense and is just a rambling bout of nonsense and I couldn't make heads or tails of any of that.

    I've also never claimed that God will not reign over heaven and earth. Another LIE from Preston AGAIN. You can't help yourself can you Don?

    Yes I do accept that death in all its forms physical and spiritual will end. I believe what Romans 8:21 says when it says "that the creation itself will be set free from its bondage to decay and obtain the freedom of the glory of the children of God".

    I also believe Paul when He says in 1 Cor 15:26 when he says "The LAST enemy to be abolished and destroyed is DEATH". Echatos echthros katargeitai ho thanatos! //

    Response: And just what has Conley thought he has "proven" here?
    My argument on "until" was plenty cogent enough that others surely understood it!
    I have never said-- get this now-- have never said that you claim God will cease to reign over heaven and earth. Show us where I have ever said anything remotely resembling that!
    See folks, this is sooo typical of Conley. He sets up all these straw men- making claims that I said such and such, which I have never said or implied-- and then calls me a liar for supposedly saying it.
    Notice how presumptive-- but unproven-- his claim is. He claims that Romans 8:2 is yet unfulfilled when "creation" will be set free from corruption."
    Conley assumes the following:
    1. Creation is the entire physical, material creation.
    2. Corruption refers to biological corruption.
    3. That there will be an end of tiem.

    No, read his post very carefully and see what proof he offers! Nope, not a keystroke. He seems to think that he can just say

    ReplyDelete
  6. And, winding down of this time wasting exercise, answering someone that can do nothing but call names and impugn the character of anyone disagreeing with him. Do you see how he "feels sorry" for anyone that differs with his take on eschatology? He feels sorry for you, but, hey, if you want to talk to him, he will straighten you out, if you want to contact him! He has the answers! (He claims).

    //I also believe Paul when He says in 1 Cor 15:26 when he says "The LAST enemy to be abolished and destroyed is DEATH". Echatos echthros katargeitai ho thanatos!

    These are about the end of DEATH. ALL DEATH. Preston is talking through one's hat here... in other words (pardon the French but) he is bs-ing all of you here.

    As for how death is defeated today? That is easy. Paul as all NT writers do before the 2nd Coming teach the already not yet principle that Don always denies because he has an agenda to sell you folks.//

    Conley cites Paul's promise that the last enemy was to be destroyed. He says this is the end of all death. Then he says "how is death defeated today?" And he says this is the "already-but-not" principle taught by the NT writers.

    Well, he is right that the NT writers do teach that principle. But of course, what Mr. Conley conveniently ignores is that they consistently posit the fulfillment of the "not yet" as imminent, coming soon, shortly, etc. etc! But of course, we must remember that according to Mr. Conley, time words in the Bible do not mean anything temporally -- that is, unless they are used in non-prophetic texts! Of course, I have totally debunked that specious claim. It is literally ludicrous and untenable.

    Notice that Paul wrote Timothy and told him that Christ had already "abolished death." Now, Mr. Conley would need to explain just how Christ had already abolished death, since he believes in the "already" concept! Just how much and to what extent had Christ already abolished physical death, Mr. Conley? Will you tell us? Kinda doubt it. You will prolly just respond with my vituperative verbiage, which is totally unbecoming of a Christian.

    Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth-- remember that command, Mr. Conley.
    Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you might know how to answer every man-- remember that command, Mr. Conley.

    Or do you consider yourself above such mundane moral mandates? Evidently you do.

    Then, Mr. Conley reaches out to all those lost souls that he believes are being duped by me. Now, it is pretty much the epitome of arrogance to go onto someone else's board and post such things. But, since Mr. Conley considers himself to be above such rules of decorum and decency, and offered that invitation, I will make the same invitation to anyone that visits HIS board! Fair is fair, right?

    ReplyDelete
  7. For anyone that wants to contact me to discuss any of this-- in a Christian manner-- feel free to contact me through my website: www.donkpreston.com, or, www.bibleprophecy.com.

    I am also on FaceBook, and you can contact me there is you wish to discuss the issues being discussed and you want the proper and true representation of what I believe, instead of false accusations coming from Mr. Conley.

    ReplyDelete

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